How to Win on Instagram without Chasing Hacks & Trends with Sydney O’Brien
Does it feel like you just can’t figure out Instagram anymore?
Between constant changes to the platform as well as hacks and trends that promise us quick wins, gaining real traction is more difficult than ever. (And there’s nothing more defeating than creating content with no results to show for it!)
In today’s episode, I’m interviewing Sydney O’Brien, a social media strategist who specializes in helping mompreneurs create connection and community on Instagram.
We cover what it means to build a community on Instagram, how you can leverage data and insights to guide your strategy, and the best method Sydney has found for converting followers into podcast listeners. If you want to attract a loyal audience on Instagram, Sydney helps you set a foundation that’ll serve you long-term and bring in more sales!
What’s in this episode…
[02:35] Why it’s more challenging than ever to gain traction on Instagram
[08:19] What it means to strategically build a community on Instagram
[12:47] How to decide on post format and planning your content
[15:26] Using analytics and insights to guide your strategy
[17:51] Converting followers into podcast listeners
Join us on Feb 22nd for the podcasting for profit workshop!
About Sydney O’Brien:
I'm an Instagram Strategist that helps mompreneurs save time and increase their profits with custom strategies.
I'm a mom of 3 young boys, a homeschooler, and a military spouse. Believe me when I say I understand the stress of wearing all the hats to accomplish all the things.
But really, my favorite thing about my business is the way it fits into my life and my family's life, not the other way around. I love helping other mom business owners find that balance instead of spending too much time creating content that isn't getting them the results they want.
I'm all about helping you find a sustainable and realistic way to strategize your content to support your business. But what makes them special is they're custom-tailored to YOU.
I'm not going to tell you to post every day, because it's not realistic. My approach is based on Instagram's features and algorithm, tried-and-true marketing, and the most efficient tools out there, alongside what will work best for your life and business.
Connect with sydney:
Get Sydney’s Free Content Calendar
Get Sydney’s Carousel Templates
LINKS:
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The Transcript for Share, Strategize, & Shine:
ep 164[00:00:00] Sydney O'Brien: Do you remember when it was like you could post a reel within trending audio and like, get so much reach and so much engagement, and now it's like it's a lot harder to do that. [00:00:09][9.2]
[00:00:14] Caroline Hull: Hi there and welcome to Share, Strategize, and Shine. I'm your host, Caroline Hull, a podcast strategist and CEO of Wild Home Podcasting. I've built my entire career through podcasts by sharing my experience using strategic systems and shining a light on the power of podcasting. If you are looking to cultivate leads for your membership, group program, or consulting services, I'm here to help you create a holistic and integrative podcast strategy that will let your business thrive. Let's dive in. [00:00:46][32.1]
[00:00:53] Caroline Hull: Hello and welcome back to Share, Strategize and Shine. Today I am chatting all about Instagram with my friend Sydney and I wanted to bring Sydney on specifically because like me, she is a mom and a homeschooler. And let me tell you, trying to do Instagram. I don't know. I think I. I put too much emphasis on it being pretty, but trying to do Instagram when my house is a mess and it's so chaotic, can feel really overwhelming. And I really love Sydney's approach to creating a strategy for your business. So it's not just about going viral, but actually about creating connection and creating community. So be sure to take notes and I hope you enjoy my conversation with Sydney. [00:01:38][45.5]
[00:01:39] Sydney O'Brien: Hi Sydney, thank you so much for coming on the show. Thank you so much for having me. I listen to it and love it. So it's like really exciting to get to be on it. [00:01:47][8.0]
[00:01:48] Caroline Hull: Vice versa. So I also listen to your podcast and I follow you on Instagram. I've learned so much from you. So I'm so excited to have you on to chat today about Instagram. But before we dive in, I want you to just tell everyone a little bit about who you are and what you do. [00:02:02][14.3]
[00:02:03] Sydney O'Brien: Sure, I am an Instagram strategist. I help mum producers make money from their Instagram accounts to support their families with their online businesses and like the least amount of time possible because I know we're all super, super busy and I have been doing it for about three years. I actually started because I got really bored while my husband was deployed. We're a military family, okay? We're all our school family, so it's really nice to be able to like work from home while homeschooling the kids, which I know you do as well. [00:02:35][31.5]
[00:02:35] Caroline Hull: Yeah, and I think that's why I connected so much with your messaging, because everything I do is done in these, like, really tiny pockets of time. And I'm always trying to maximize what I'm doing. We talk a lot about this when we talk about podcasts, you know, maximizing the time, maximizing what you're doing. And that's really why I fell in love with your account. And we may have been in the same bundle and I downloaded you're saying. And I was like, oh my gosh, this is so good. So I'm just really excited to dive in today. And so yeah, let's start there. Why is Instagram so hard for mom for nurse specifically? [00:03:07][32.0]
[00:03:09] Sydney O'Brien: It can take a lot of time, especially because like a lot of the advice you see on there is for like hacks and like chasing trends instead of focusing more on like the strategy behind it, like the that'll get you like the long term, like community that will bring in the sales so it can feel really defeating, like chasing after those hacks and trends and not seeing the results for your business. [00:03:36][27.0]
[00:03:37] Caroline Hull: Yeah, and I feel that on a deeply personal level, because Instagram, like I used to love Instagram, I was in an Instagram mastermind. I, you know, I was going to put all my eggs in the Instagram basket because I loved it so much. And this year has been, well, year, let's say last six months or so. I have been so difficult to get. I feel like any kind of traction on Instagram. Do you feel like you hear other business owners saying that, or is it just Caroline and what she's doing? [00:04:06][29.4]
[00:04:07] Sydney O'Brien: I don't know, it's everyone but chercher especially like a lot has changed with it. It used to be, I don't know how long you've been on Instagram, but do you remember when it was like you could post a reel within trending audio and, like, get so much reach and so much engagement and now it's like, it's a lot harder to do that. Yeah. But it does bring about this really interesting, focus that I've seen where it's easier to focus in on creating like a community when you find your people like that super specific target audience, and even if they don't buy from you, they're like your people and like super loyal followers. So they're still like recommending you to other people, which is very helpful. [00:04:49][42.1]
[00:04:50] Caroline Hull: Okay, I want to dive into this like community aspect, and I'm going to be honest with everyone listening and watching like this was not words expecting this interview to go. So I'm really, really excited. But also on a backtrack for a minute and you mentioned that do I remember when you could go viral with a real and a and a sound? I remember when you go viral, when a picture of your breakfast and sell your products with a picture of your breakfast, like I've been on Instagram, I think, since it was invented. And I'll let you guys all Google that and figure out a whole album later. So I do feel like it's definitely, it feels like this wave of like, I've got it figured out. I know what I'm doing. Oh my gosh, everything changed. I've got it figured out, and now I feel like I just can't figure it out. I know there's other people who feel that way too. Like it's just and so. But you're right. Because then what happens is you start chasing the, the weird strategies. You see people posting. And I saw one the other day, it was like, you, it's just a keyword stuff. Your real estate. Have you seen this? [00:05:59][69.2]
[00:06:00] Sydney O'Brien: I think I have where you like hide the keywords in your content. Yeah. I mean, it's an it's an interesting idea. I haven't tried it. It's your face. Says it all. She says, don't do it. That's what she's saying. [00:06:13][13.7]
[00:06:15] Caroline Hull: So you posted a really great post the other day, and it said that the key was not to go viral like that. That shouldn't be your goal. So what should we be trying to do on Instagram instead? [00:06:28][12.7]
[00:06:29] Sydney O'Brien: Definitely. I mean, it's very easy to want that because it is such a big thing. And like vanity metrics can be incredibly validating. Like seeing those those like likes and comments and everything. But if you don't have the strategy like to your overall content and you do go viral, you might still might not be getting the sale. So it doesn't matter if you focus on like, the overall strategy and making sure that, like, all of your content is working together to guide your followers down the funnel, to eventually be a buyer. And like you have that sense of community where everyone is just engaged and like learning from your super valuable content, you're going to have a much easier time because you can be like completely booked out with 300 followers. You can also have like 10,000 followers and not sell anything. So I don't think it's worth it to chase vanity metrics. [00:07:25][56.6]
[00:07:26] Caroline Hull: Yeah, I think that's a really, really key thing that you said. And I know people have heard me talk about that in relation to podcasting as well, but I think that's just like a general kind of thing that we fall into because we think, oh, if I just get the 10,000 followers, then I'll be making sales. If I just get the, you know, I don't know, I don't know what the next thing is if I can just go viral, get, you know, 10,000 views on this real, then everybody will buy my thing. And that's that's not necessarily it because it's not targeted. Right. [00:08:01][35.0]
[00:08:03] Sydney O'Brien: Right. Exactly. Because you could go viral for like a super, I don't know, trendy reel of you like being silly or dancing, but if it doesn't relate back to like what you do and it isn't specifically for your target audience, it's not going to convert to sales. So what is the point? [00:08:19][16.0]
[00:08:19] Caroline Hull: Right, right. Just to make you feel better, to make you feel like people are actually looking at yourself when in on the flip side of that, you can have the right people looking at your stuff on Instagram, and that would make more of an impact on your bottom line, right? Yeah. So let's talk about this community piece for a minute, because I think it leads into my next question. When you talk about having a community on Instagram, can you explain what you mean by that and what that could look like? [00:08:44][25.1]
[00:08:45] Sydney O'Brien: Yeah. So it's like just to back up a little bit. So social media was made for like community and finding people connecting with people like virtually. Right. So it's really hard to sell on Instagram, I'm not going to lie to you, but it is a lot easier when you have, like, this constantly engaged audience, the people that get value from your posts. They look forward to seeing your content. They're engaging, they're sharing all of that. They feel like they're really connected with you because you are speaking directly to them, directly to like what they need. That like sense of community is going to make your life a lot easier as a business owner on Instagram. [00:09:23][38.6]
[00:09:24] Caroline Hull: Yeah, I feel like and I could this is from personal experience, but for me it's been really hard to find that community piece on Instagram. And I'm assuming that this all boils down to content, right? [00:09:38][13.6]
[00:09:39] Sydney O'Brien: Yeah, a lot of it is content. Some of it is also like outbound engagement, like finding the right accounts to like, interact with and making sure you're also engaging with your followers. Because, I mean, it's like any kind of relationship, there has to be like a given, a take. You can't just expect people to give you that interaction if you're not also giving it to them, you're not going to have that connection otherwise. [00:10:01][22.4]
[00:10:02] Caroline Hull: Yeah. So you're saying that we need to also spend time engaging. We don't just post and walk away and expect people to buy. Exactly. Yes. But. One of the words that I keep hearing you say, which which I love, and you know this because I love this word, I use it all the time for podcasting is strategy. And so when we're thinking about an Instagram strategy, where do you suggest we start? Or what's like the first steps to thinking about, okay, I want to take this account. I've been posting things. Nothing's happening. Let's try and stretch. Well, what does that look like? [00:10:40][37.6]
[00:10:40] Sydney O'Brien: Yeah. So the first step to me is always I'm feel like I've said it a lot, but focusing on that connection. So like sharing the posts that are relatable to your target audience, you're not even necessarily like selling or educating. It's more posting like about your business, why you do what you do, sharing these like relatable things that they will connect with and that will start conversations. For me, I have that's been my focus like this. The first part of this year and my engagement has gone up like 93% because of how. Yeah, so honing in on what your audience like wants to see and what they find relatable is super helpful for that. And then from there, educating, showing that you're an authority in whatever your industry is like with case studies and everything. And then the next part would be actually promoting your offers, but you got to like build those levels before you just start selling. [00:11:37][56.8]
[00:11:38] Caroline Hull: Yeah. That's so funny that you said that because I as you were talking, I was thinking in my brain, okay, but what about selling, right. You know, do you post a week out like I was going to ask you a technical question, but really it's about building that foundation. Your account needs to have that foundation strong first, right? Yeah. And it sounds really familiar. I'm laughing because it sounds like podcast strategy and what I teach. And I'm sitting here going, well, you know, why don't we just apply this to everything but to all content marketing? [00:12:08][30.2]
[00:12:11] Caroline Hull: Are you feeling frustrated because your podcast is not working for your business the way that you want it to? I completely understand, and one of the best places to start to get you back on track is with an audit. During an audit, I look at everything from your assets to your feed, to your goals for your business and your content, and how your podcast is supporting those goals to actually help you move forward. If you want to take your podcast to the next level, I highly encourage you get an audit. Head to WildHomePodcasting.com/audit. [00:12:43][32.2]
[00:12:47] Caroline Hull: So if the strategy then is is to create content that gets people to engage. I feel like there's been this kind of push and pull. I hear different things from different people. They talk about reels versus static images versus carousels. Is there some kind of rule about how we should be showing up on Instagram? [00:13:06][19.0]
[00:13:07] Sydney O'Brien: No, it kind of depends on like each audience, because like for me, carousels normally do better than reels. Really. So yeah. And sometimes static images get a lot more reach than either one, like the single image posts. So I would check your insights and see if you're looking for if you specifically want to get more comments, look and see which posts have the most post interactions and check and see like what the topic of the post was and what the format was, and try and repurpose that. [00:13:39][32.4]
[00:13:40] Caroline Hull: Repurpose it. So can you also explain that because you just posted about repurposing literally the other day? [00:13:46][6.3]
[00:13:48] Sydney O'Brien: Yeah, I love repurposing everything because a lot of Instagram is like. Repeating yourself over and over, just doing it in slightly different ways. So if you can say, find ways to repurpose a post and like that's your carousel, you could also take that same information and just re purpose it and say, I only have like ten minutes and I need to have a week's worth of content. Here's what I do and then go into how you repurpose it. You can use that same topic in that same information and just reframe it in different ways. [00:14:22][34.4]
[00:14:23] Caroline Hull: Yeah. So when you're working with clients and you're helping them work through kind of some of these content issues that we're talking about, do you schedule this all out ahead of time? Like do you have a calendar and you know what you're going to post every day? Or how do you do that? [00:14:38][15.6]
[00:14:39] Sydney O'Brien: I do I do a month of content at a time for clients. Yeah. [00:14:43][3.5]
[00:14:43] Caroline Hull: Really. Do you really? And and so do you know, like when you're creating that content schedule, if it's going to be a real or a carousel or a post. [00:14:51][8.7]
[00:14:53] Sydney O'Brien: Yeah. [00:14:53][0.0]
[00:14:54] Caroline Hull: You make it sound so easy! [00:14:55][1.0]
[00:14:56] Sydney O'Brien: Yeah, I mean, it is like different for each person, but depending on, like what I want for the post and like what the purpose of it is, that's how I'll choose what the format's going to be if I want. Like if the client wants more followers, I will look and see what post normally gets the most followers and repurpose it. If they are like having a sale or something, I will look and see which one has the most, generates the most clicks to their website and repurpose that. [00:15:26][29.8]
[00:15:26] Caroline Hull: Yeah, and so now we're getting down to something really interesting and that is analytics. And I think this is where a lot of us get tripped up is I hear you like, I totally hear what you're saying about going back and looking at posts. It's the same with podcast episodes, but like the actual doing it and knowing what I'm supposed to be looking for seems to be really hard. How often should you be looking at those insights and using them to make decisions? [00:15:53][27.0]
[00:15:54] Sydney O'Brien: I do like a brief glance, like at the end of every month and then normally every like quarter, I'll do like a deeper dive and be like, okay, so this particular thing is like what I need to really focus on to hit my goals. [00:16:08][13.9]
[00:16:09] Caroline Hull: And, you know, like based on the insights, you're able to say, okay, do I want more engagement? Am I wanting more interaction? Like I'm thinking like comments to get a rank to purchase a thing, and you can kind of see which ones were leading people to do the thing you wanted to do, and then you just reinvent that. Yeah. And this is why I love your feed so much and why I love listening to you, because you do make it sound so simple. Because if there's anything humans are really good at, it's complicating things. And I think I've complicated Instagram to no end, so I'm sure everybody listening can relate because they probably feel the same way. You know, you post and you post and you're like, you know, why didn't why did not work? Or I listen to a podcast and somebody was posting three times a day and I was like, oh, I'm going to try that. It didn't work. It actually lowered my views and engagement. Well, yeah. And so I think that just like all goes back to, you know, what you were saying is that you have to have a strategy. And I'm literally going to sit down after our interviews over a recorded episode about why cookie cutter strategies don't work. And I think this is this is a really good example of that, because, like you said, you have to understand what your goals are about, what your goals are for your post. Right? Yes. Yeah. I want to ask you two about podcasts and podcasting. And I'm curious how if you have any insight into posting on Instagram about your podcast and what has worked best for you, do you feel like Instagram is good at converting people to listeners? [00:17:50][101.3]
[00:17:51] Sydney O'Brien: So my podcast is still pretty new. I've seen like some but not a ton. Okay, so when I promote my podcast on my Instagram feed, I normally do like one like sound bite thing from my podcast and that usually does like okay. Yeah. And then at the end of that same week I will do like an educational carousel about the topic. And the call to action will always be like, head to the link in my bio to get more information. And that one where there's it's just like. It goes a little bit more in depth. Those ones get much more listens and like clicks to the podcast. Yeah. [00:18:28][36.5]
[00:18:28] Caroline Hull: Yeah. And I think that's such a good use of the content to like taking your podcast episode and creating carousel. I've found really good success with that as well. But I think like, you have to have something really attention grabbing on that front. On that first image. Right. [00:18:44][15.8]
[00:18:45] Sydney O'Brien: Yeah. I usually something like a question or for a hook or, how to get and then, like, whatever desired outcome. Like the topic is about or like a pinpoint driven type of hook. [00:18:59][14.0]
[00:19:00] Caroline Hull: So you have a really good, resource or something, right. For carousels. Could you share what that is? [00:19:05][5.5]
[00:19:06] Sydney O'Brien: Yeah. I have a set of templates for carousels. It's like a plug and play template. There's seven carousels where you have the copy for each slide and the caption, and it also comes with a worksheet because I bought templates before and I read them and I'm like, I don't even know what to put in here. Yeah. So there's a little worksheet to help you figure out the right terms to put into the templates so you can use them to sell your offers. They're all promotional carousels. [00:19:32][25.9]
[00:19:32] Caroline Hull: Oh my gosh that's amazing. And I think great. Having that guide is so smart. And we'll put the link to those in the show notes because I know especially for creating them for podcasts, I think they're really, really valuable. In fact, we did a whole training in my membership about this, and I don't make my carousels. I have somebody who makes my carousels. I don't make them myself because I do find them so difficult to get right. So I love that you have a guide for that. So we'll definitely link to that in the show notes. And then could you share. Do you have like what would next up speed for somebody if they wanted to work with you or get some help with their Instagram? I highly, highly, highly recommend everyone listening. Go follow her on Instagram because your posts. I've learned so much just from your post, but they're also just incredibly reassuring when I feel like I'm messing Instagram up. So tell us how we can connect with you and kind of what next steps would be. [00:20:26][53.4]
[00:20:27] Sydney O'Brien: Yeah, definitely find me on Instagram and send me a DM. And let me know. Like what exactly you need help with, whether it's just knowing what to post or the strategy side of it. And I can help you out for sure. [00:20:39][12.6]
[00:20:40] Sydney O'Brien: That's awesome. And you have a podcast as well, so tell everyone about that. I do it is called Mompreneur Mastery, and it's all very actionable things. On how to strategize your Instagram to build that connection I was talking about and make more sales. [00:20:56][15.9]
[00:20:57] Caroline Hull: It's a really good podcast. Go listen to it. I really love it. Well, thank you so much, Sydney for coming on the show and sharing all your Instagram wisdom. I'm, so say for everybody listening and to help feel better about Instagram and having a strategy. [00:21:11][14.2]
[00:21:12] Sydney O'Brien: Thank you so much for having me. [00:21:13][1.2]
[00:21:14] Caroline Hull: I just love bringing on other strategists onto this podcast because I feel like whenever we talk strategy, it's almost like it's our own special language and we all speak the same language. And it's also really interesting because I think as content creators and business owners, we can do this all day for our clients, but doing it for ourselves is a completely different story. And so I really do think, like if you're struggling with strategy for Instagram or your podcast, it's so important to get help because again, I can really help a lot of people with their podcast content. But trying to decide what to post on Instagram every day stresses me out. So. You know, it just really it's all about perspective, I think. I hope you enjoyed this episode, and I hope that you are ready to think about your Instagram a little bit differently. I know that I will be for sure. Be sure to follow Sydney on all the places and check out her links in the show notes, and I'll be back next week with a new episode. [00:22:13][59.5]
[00:22:15] Caroline Hull: Thank you for listening to Share, Strategize and Shine. To give your own podcast some shine, download my free Podcast Guide to Creating Episodes for Sales by heading to the link in the show notes. Be sure to leave a review and connect with me on Instagram for more podcast strategy insights. Until next time.: How to Win on Instagram without Chasing Hacks & Trends with Sydney O’Brien
